Article Comment: Photos of the Week
09/18/2013 8:57:02 PM
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I hate to be a jerk, but isn't holding hands across the finish line grounds for disqualification according to NFHS rules? Seems like this occurred in a 4A State Meet 10 years or so ago & the girls were DQed. Maybe I'm wrong. Also, one of the girls has one or more bracelets on. Here's something I've always found amusing... jewelry, including bracelets is illegal, yet NCHSAA requires athletes at the state meet to were tyvek bracelets. Hmm...
I hate to be a jerk, but isn't holding hands across the finish line grounds for disqualification according to NFHS rules? Seems like this occurred in a 4A State Meet 10 years or so ago & the girls were DQed. Maybe I'm wrong. Also, one of the girls has one or more bracelets on. Here's something I've always found amusing... jewelry, including bracelets is illegal, yet NCHSAA requires athletes at the state meet to were tyvek bracelets. Hmm...
09/18/2013 9:12:35 PM
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@CoachSpencer It might be technical grounds for DQ, but the INTENT of the rule is to prevent one athlete from assisting another across the line. I certainly don't think this violates the spirit of the rule. Besides, this photo is a step after the line...
@CoachSpencer It might be technical grounds for DQ, but the INTENT of the rule is to prevent one athlete from assisting another across the line. I certainly don't think this violates the spirit of the rule. Besides, this photo is a step after the line...
09/18/2013 10:01:02 PM
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Really? These two girls dominated the race from the beginning and in the spirit of team unity and sportsmanship they hold raised hands across the finish (and actually before the finish). I happened to take that shot and was appreciative of the team-focus that they were demonstrating. Today I was pleasantly surprised to see my photo at the top of the NC Runners page but then equally dismayed by Coach Spenser's remarks. I'd like to know what he would have done had he been the official there that morning. As CoachGeorgeRJR noted, there are rules but it is the intent of the that should be addressed. Congratulations to those two young women. They were great that day, made their team, the sport and their parents proud.
Really? These two girls dominated the race from the beginning and in the spirit of team unity and sportsmanship they hold raised hands across the finish (and actually before the finish). I happened to take that shot and was appreciative of the team-focus that they were demonstrating. Today I was pleasantly surprised to see my photo at the top of the NC Runners page but then equally dismayed by Coach Spenser's remarks. I'd like to know what he would have done had he been the official there that morning. As CoachGeorgeRJR noted, there are rules but it is the intent of the that should be addressed. Congratulations to those two young women. They were great that day, made their team, the sport and their parents proud.
09/19/2013 6:54:05 AM
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Enforcing intent and spirit of rules early in the season will get you DQ'ed at Conference, Regional and State meets!!! As a official, I would have pulled them to the side and made sure that they knew the rules(including the jewelry) for future meets. You don't want to give the opposing coach that loses the Regional Meet by 2 points the chance to protest because they would win this one and the meet.
Enforcing intent and spirit of rules early in the season will get you DQ'ed at Conference, Regional and State meets!!! As a official, I would have pulled them to the side and made sure that they knew the rules(including the jewelry) for future meets. You don't want to give the opposing coach that loses the Regional Meet by 2 points the chance to protest because they would win this one and the meet.
09/19/2013 7:34:27 AM
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That would be a very fair response....but if there are rules which could impugn the sportmanship seen here, then those rules should be clarified because what they did is never wrong and should not be discouraged be it an early season meet or at state.
That would be a very fair response....but if there are rules which could impugn the sportmanship seen here, then those rules should be clarified because what they did is never wrong and should not be discouraged be it an early season meet or at state.
09/19/2013 8:21:51 AM
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Ah, I should've known better than to come out from under my rock & make comments in this board. MY intent was to relay an understanding of the National Federation rules so people don't make these mistakes when the consequences are greater- conference, regional & state meets. My goal was not to makea judgement call that these girls were doing anything "bad," only to make people aware of the rules. The rule book prohibits physical contact & Rule 4-6.7 prohibits "competitors joining or grasping hands with each other during a race." I was wrong about remembering the incident at the state meet. I was told by the coach it was at the old 4 Runners Inv at Tanglewood. I understand the grasping of hands or helping a fallen running illicits emotional responses & headlines but it's not legal. Neither is wearing jewelry. Just a public service announcement. Back to the rock.
Ah, I should've known better than to come out from under my rock & make comments in this board. MY intent was to relay an understanding of the National Federation rules so people don't make these mistakes when the consequences are greater- conference, regional & state meets. My goal was not to makea judgement call that these girls were doing anything "bad," only to make people aware of the rules. The rule book prohibits physical contact & Rule 4-6.7 prohibits "competitors joining or grasping hands with each other during a race." I was wrong about remembering the incident at the state meet. I was told by the coach it was at the old 4 Runners Inv at Tanglewood. I understand the grasping of hands or helping a fallen running illicits emotional responses & headlines but it's not legal. Neither is wearing jewelry. Just a public service announcement. Back to the rock.
09/19/2013 10:57:51 AM
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Please don't go back under the rock. Ha. My responses weren't meant to be contentious but there are a lot of pretty subtle details to some of these rules, and sometimes they aren't well clarified even when you've been around a lot of races. We've seen controversies about handing kids water on a 5k course, jewelry issues, etc...and you of course hear that competitors cant receive physical assistance...but the letter of the rule is really much broader. Thanks for the additional information.
Please don't go back under the rock. Ha. My responses weren't meant to be contentious but there are a lot of pretty subtle details to some of these rules, and sometimes they aren't well clarified even when you've been around a lot of races. We've seen controversies about handing kids water on a 5k course, jewelry issues, etc...and you of course hear that competitors cant receive physical assistance...but the letter of the rule is really much broader. Thanks for the additional information.
09/19/2013 2:46:26 PM
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Great photo, thanks for taking it. ..I actually told them they were dq'd as a joke, but deep down know there are coaches that would actually protest such a violation. I respect the rules, this one just slipped. And watches are legal, so it's one bracelet. As for them holding hands, these two push each other on a daily basis and happened to have had a moment...rule or not, sad that can't just be appreciated. Brian Schultz
Great photo, thanks for taking it. ..I actually told them they were dq'd as a joke, but deep down know there are coaches that would actually protest such a violation. I respect the rules, this one just slipped. And watches are legal, so it's one bracelet. As for them holding hands, these two push each other on a daily basis and happened to have had a moment...rule or not, sad that can't just be appreciated. Brian Schultz
09/19/2013 9:17:39 PM
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Agree Great Photo. I have known Coach Spencer for 14 years long before either of us were associated with HS running. I am confident he did not intend to create an issue just a better understanding of the rules. Glad the post did not get contentious either. Best, GS
Agree Great Photo. I have known Coach Spencer for 14 years long before either of us were associated with HS running. I am confident he did not intend to create an issue just a better understanding of the rules. Glad the post did not get contentious either.

Best,
GS
09/20/2013 8:33:14 AM
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This is just one of those situations where no one is really wrong, we just are faced with regulations that put us in a corner where there is no good "out". It was my girls - 5 of them - that held hands as they crossed the finish line at the 4 runners meet about 10 years ago - they were not dq'ed but were told not to do it in the future - it was not anything they planned until at the end they just decided to do it - it does put meet officials in a bad spot though - I once had a girl who won the 3200 at the conference meet get dq'ed for having her shorts rolled, the Independence girls 4x400 team in indoor on year won the state title but were dq'ed for one girl having the wrong kind of undergarment - like Rick says, its just better not to have officials have to make those kind of decisions if at all possible. Hah, even more recently, last year at UNCWilmington it was so hot one of my girls told a girl to throw water on her as she ran by - I told her that was not really permissible and not to do it again but we never really know what kids will do - this past week at Furman in the JV race I had a girl who had to REALLY use the bathroom - there was a spot on the course loop where the portajons were right beside the course - she left course, went in to portajon, came back out and went right to where she left the course and continued on - I just went what the heck? In my 26 years of doing this I think I have seen it all - but to get back to Rick and Lamont's point of emphasis - the problem in many cases at the state meet is that previous races have let rules slide (especially with uniform and jewelry issues) so that officials at state meets are considered ogres for enforcing the rules - it is incumbent upon us to educate our kids while still letting them have their fun - in the case of my girls at the Tanglewood meet I would have accepted a dq in that meet but certainly would not have liked it at a state meet which is what Lamont and Rick are trying to point out
This is just one of those situations where no one is really wrong, we just are faced with regulations that put us in a corner where there is no good "out". It was my girls - 5 of them - that held hands as they crossed the finish line at the 4 runners meet about 10 years ago - they were not dq'ed but were told not to do it in the future - it was not anything they planned until at the end they just decided to do it - it does put meet officials in a bad spot though - I once had a girl who won the 3200 at the conference meet get dq'ed for having her shorts rolled, the Independence girls 4x400 team in indoor on year won the state title but were dq'ed for one girl having the wrong kind of undergarment - like Rick says, its just better not to have officials have to make those kind of decisions if at all possible. Hah, even more recently, last year at UNCWilmington it was so hot one of my girls told a girl to throw water on her as she ran by - I told her that was not really permissible and not to do it again but we never really know what kids will do - this past week at Furman in the JV race I had a girl who had to REALLY use the bathroom - there was a spot on the course loop where the portajons were right beside the course - she left course, went in to portajon, came back out and went right to where she left the course and continued on - I just went what the heck? In my 26 years of doing this I think I have seen it all - but to get back to Rick and Lamont's point of emphasis - the problem in many cases at the state meet is that previous races have let rules slide (especially with uniform and jewelry issues) so that officials at state meets are considered ogres for enforcing the rules - it is incumbent upon us to educate our kids while still letting them have their fun - in the case of my girls at the Tanglewood meet I would have accepted a dq in that meet but certainly would not have liked it at a state meet which is what Lamont and Rick are trying to point out

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